Muslim Brotherhood in America with Steve Emerson


You’ve heard of the Muslim Brotherhood
founded in Egypt in 1928 as a religious political and social
movement. Today it’s probably the most influential political group in the Arab
world One of their stated goals is to introduce
Sharia or Islamic law quote “as the basis controlling the
affairs of state and society” but what does that mean for us? According
to Steve Emerson Executive Director of the Investigative
Project on Terrorism, the Muslim Brotherhood has designs on the United
States and they’ve been pretty active here
While they say they’re moderate mainstream and all for democracy they’re not. Steve Emerson has produced a
film focused on the Muslim Brotherhood’s
activities in the US; it’s called Jihad in America The Grand Deception and he joins me in
the studio. Steve welcome. Thank you. Since 9/11 the US government
has been very focused on Al Qaeda because they attacked us on 9/11 why
should we care about the Muslim Brotherhood? First of all, the Muslim Brotherhood is the
parent to Al Qaeda as it is the parent of Hamas, Islamic
Jihad, and every Sunni terrorist group Number two, the Muslim Brotherhood is
really the ideological origins of of all these violent groups even
though the Muslim Brotherhood says it’s against violence it foments violence, incites violence
and it has a supremacist view of the world it wants to establish
a caliphate not just in Egypt but around the world and
in the United States It’s not just me who says that they have
an ulterior agenda but rather the US government which discovered a cache of
documents not so far from the studios here which showed um, um, internal hundreds of thousands of internal Muslim Brotherhood documents that were never discovered by the US government
until 2005 showing what their intentions were and…
What are their intentions, what do they want from the United States? Well I mean
ultimately the essence of the film is to show juxtaposed
what goes on behind closed doors at Islamist meetings, Muslim Brotherhood
meetings conferences versus what they say
publicly. Publicly as I say they they’re against terrorism, they’re for peace and
they’re for love and mother and apple pie but behind
closed doors they talk about jihad, they talk about
martyrdom operations, they talk about taking over the United States I mean we must have at least 11 clips where
major Islamic American leaders talk about that Islam will take over the US whether
it’s. But take over the US in what way? Well. I mean what does that mean? That’s a problem. I mean, to us it’s almost crazy talk
because it’s almost impossible for us to even
conceive of that but for them we have to think that that’s their mindset and and they really do believe and they wrote in their documents that the America that the United States is a prime uh central regional center in the world from which the Muslim Brotherhood should
operate in terms of spreading its tentacles through the media through law enforcement through academia and they’ve done that very successfully
um playing the the victim card and and and that victim
card basically allows them to promote their agenda under false guise.
So Steve give me an example of something that they’ve done that
has had a negative impact on the United States Unfortunately the Muslim Brotherhood is in control of the leadership the religious institutions the media and that’s where they the the followers
get their news and get their cultural attitudes and they tell their their followers
don’t talk to the FBI that there’s a war against Islam. The
notion that there’s a war against Islam is the number one uh conspiratorial and false allegation that inspires
Islamic terrorism and and so they’re not pulling the gun
the trigger but they are cultural jihadists and they are inciting others to carry
out attacks. Steve Emerson is in the studio with me. He’s the executive director of
the Investigative Project on Terrorism He’s also executive producer of the
award-winning documentary film Jihad in America, the Grand Deception.
Steve, your critics say that you’re in a Islamaphobe What, what do you say to that? Look, it, the critics who say that are the radical
Islamic groups um, you know, or their sympathizers and bottom line is the Islam
Islamophobia is a contrived term Um, wh what is phobia? A phobia is a an irrational fear. Seventy percent
according to CIA statistics of all international terrorism is
carried out by radical Muslims and so there it’s not an
irrational fear I’m not justifying it but it’s a rational fear
and in fact there’s a we have a couple of sermons by some
imams who say Islamophobia is a fake, Islamophobia is
used as a as a way of intimidating smearing anyone who criticizes radical Islam um I don’t criticize Islam. Islam is a
religion you know and and its adherents practice most majority
are peaceful and don’t wanna have anything to do with violence but I criticize radical Islam or political
Islam but the my critics. But what’s the difference? What’s the difference between Islamism and Islam? Okay um Islam Well, first of all religions are abstractions
it’s how you practice it um and um the real problem with
Islam is that hasn’t undergone a reformation
absent the reformation you have the literal constructionalists who
basically take the Koranic verses about holy war
or jihad uh (inaudible) of spreading Islam converting
everybody and they still practice it today I mean
jihad is holy war although their apologists like to say
it’s just more strident like you know Internal struggle yeah I mean but
that’s not the original meaning of it at all um and the reality is is that um the problem here is that the
people in charge who are the leadership Yusuf al-Qaradawi to the al-Azhar University to Al Jazeera the people who are, the imams many of the Madrasa and the madrasats the the Islamic schools are part of the, mu,
Islamist uh, Brotherhood maybe not the Muslim
Brotherhood formally but there’s a constellation of values and
interests and so the rest…And that that core value
that core interest is is a caliphate? Well yes yes but but not
necessarily explicitly stated like that sometimes it’s it’s like the Reston Saudi Academy
had two sets of books that was discovered by the Hudson
Institute. One set of books was for the public to look at and the other set of books
internally call for the killing of Jews and Christians This was where? This was here in Reston, uh, Reston Virginia. In Virginia right the Saudi Academy so and and and through look I’ve been doing this work
for seventeen years now the Investigative Project on Terrorism focuses on radical Islam the reason I
focus on it was because when I first did my first
documentary in 1994 called Jihad in America um there was no youtube, there was no
Google or anything so if you wanted to find out what a group was doing you couldn’t find out you know you have
to write to them so what I realized at that point I did that
film we did undercover video showing that these groups had basically um morphed themselves into legitimate
organizations Hamas, Hezbollah, Islamic Jihad, Al Qaeda even into charitable fronts I mean that’s
why after 9/11 21 charitable fronts were closed down as
terrorist organizations they should have been closed down back
in the 1990s but there was no incentives to do it because not
enough people had died Steve as a society we have a lot of
collective guilt and it’s justified from slavery and segregation and the
internment of the Japanese Americans and Mccarthyism a lot of people will say you know what this
is just the latest incident of that, this is anti-Muslim
hatred and it’s wrong. There there isn’t
anti-Muslim I mean the bottom line is if you look at the stats let’s say the hate crime stats that the
FBI produces um, the, if you look at what the islamic
groups say they say that there’s a vast majority of hate crimes against Muslims
and Islamophobia led by Steve Emerson that causes that and every bottom line if you look at the stats and
average in the last 10 years of only about 11 percent per year of hate crimes are carried out against Muslims eighty percent are carried out against Jews so so one there isn’t is this vast
number amount of hatred number two uh, americans are very accepting here um you know the latest public opinion polls even in New York
after the Ground Zero mosque episode show that a majority of New Yorkers you know welcomed another mosque just not built at Ground Zero um so there isn’t the vast hatred what’s
happened is that the Islamic groups thrive under the notion that they’re
under attack this is their their raison d’être. You’re saying
they promote that idea? Absolutely they they promote the idea there under attack since
1095 they remember 1095 the year of the first crusades as if it happened yesterday and they
believe the West is has been engaged in a conspiracy
to subjugate Islam. Why? Because Islam used to be on top of the
world during the 16th century and then it it basically receded after the
gates of Vienna and it lost out on the industrial revolution the
Renaissance it lost out on all the major movements in the West the
West progressed now you know literal structural Islam is
supremacist by the Muslim Brotherhood they believe
they should control the world the world is divided between dar al harb the house of war where Islam doesn’t reign
supreme and you can wage war to impose it and dar al Islam where Islam does reign
supreme and so they, the only way they can
explain the fact that they’re not on top of the world as as they often say is it must be because of the West yes it’s a conspiracy and and no other
ethnic group of ethnic groups who come to the United States inaudible integrate okay now of course there are other groups you know there’s there’s the Mafia Italian mafia and there you know drug Columbian drug cartels the
Japanese Yakuza these are ethnic groups that are engaged in violence or criminal
conspiracies we have no problem talking about their ethnicity but now you cannot use the term radical
Islam I mean this administration is prohibited that term and it started
under the Bush administration so when I was on Hannity & Colmes
several years ago and by the way if uh if people at Gitmo
really wanted the prisoners to talk they would have put them in front of Alan
Colmes for three hours instead of pulling their fingernails but having said that Alan Colmes said to me Islamic fas
fas fascism is a racist terms so I said how about Islamic militant Racist. How about Islamic extremism he said
racist and then I said about white racist. That shut ’em up. The point is if you can identify your enemy
then you can’t defeat him this is not a war against terrorism it’s
a war against radical Islam that they imposed on us. Steve Emerson is in the studio with me
executive director of the Investigative Project on Terrorism We’re discussing his film called Jihad
in America The Grand Deception. You were originally a
journalist how did you get involved in this and and
start the Investigative Project on Journalism, on Terrorism sorry sure well now I’m a recovering journalist
the only thing I really believe are the sports scores Um yeah I I I worked first on the hill then I worked at US
News and World Report then at the New York Times Magazine for a
while as a freelancer and then at CNN as a special correspondent. What
happened was that in 1993, 94 93 after the first World Trade
Center bombing in February of that year which killed seven people in New York
uh CNN asked me as a correspondent to do a special on that
bombing and I proposed to do a special about how these radical
Islamic groups had morphed into legitimate organizations in
the US and CNN wouldn’t do it and hell has no fury like a journalist
scorned so I quit I took the proposal to the Corporation for
Public Broadcasting which is the parent group PBS They gave seed money I lived in Pakistan um and and also went to Afghanistan for six
months, lived with the Mujahideen and they gave me incredible material
little did I know that I was actually living with al Qaeda um and little did they know who you
would become. Right, well thank that God there wasn’t Google at that point. That’s right. So um, but but the the you know the
interesting thing was that as I was leaving they gave me a present
of a lot of videotapes um and when I plugged them in the uh, United States into my VCR they turned out to be the radical Islamic
Conferences held in Columbus Ohio in Brooklyn New York in Oklahoma City In the nineties. Inaudible states,yes all all
all these rad the most radical islamic leaders and the FBI was oblivious to
this so I did this film and I realized that
nobody else was collecting this now I would not have created the
organization if there were other people looking at this There’s the Southern Poverty Law Center that looks at you know white racism indigenous white extremist groups and there other groups that look at civil rights
organization civil rights groups but nobody was looking at radical
Islamic groups nobody and the FBI was constrained because of
civil liberties issues they could only engage in uh any investigations to criminal
predicates but political issues was you know and still is prohibited from being investigated so
it’s not illegal for an Islamic leader to say death to America
but frankly politically if it were known that an advisor to the president or friend a
visitor to the president is saying death to America behind closed
doors and yet is being sent abroad by the president as an emissary to the United
States that’s a bombshell. And that’s happened?
Absolutely many times and in fact we document it in the film. On
your website you’ve got a a link called “send a tip” what is that? That’s for people wanna you know who
have inside information or have you know we’ve come across information
and you know don’t have the capacity to further
investigate it but. Have you gotten things through that? we have gotten things through that we got from government officials and from other private citizens and you know not
all of it pans out but some of it has been phenomenally you
know remember peep people don’t always know what
they’re looking at um you know the the Chautauqua Institute
invites all of these radical Muslim leaders to speak there as moderates but in fact behind
closed doors in other sessions these these leaders
say other things calling for jihad and so um you know there’s deception
that’s that’s why I called the film The Grand
Deception um it actually came from a from a wiretap of a Hamas meeting in
1993 that the FBI wiretapped Hamas leaders and
they talked about deception and how they were gonna use deception
to fool the American public and creating a political group in the
United States to promote Hamas under a civil rights ban and so that’s why
I call it “The Grand Deception” and the deception has been very
successful in Congress Hollywood the media and the government and it’s not just successful in terms of
unwitting deception sometimes there’s witting collaboration.
Let’s talk about in 2004 because there is a man picked up
for taking pictures of the Chesapeake Bay Bridge in
Maryland he was linked to Hamas and then the FBI I guess raided his home what did they find? They found the
most startling and important cachet of national
security documents since the pumpkin papers over alger hiss
back in the nineteen forties it was the most startling discovery
hundreds of thousand documents this man Ismail Elbarasse was the
archivist of the Muslim Brotherhood in the United States and he kept records of everything who got paid who
were the officials where were they getting their orders from what there plans were um it was it was amazing that the US government had
no knowledge of this um and yet it was the biggest find ever
and they used it they’ve declassified only five
percent we’ve seen a lot more and it’s phenomenal material. There’s something called the explanatory memo. What’s in that? The explanatory memorandum is one of the major major memorandums that was written by um the Muslim
Brotherhood back in 1991 talking about the need for a civ.. quote a civilizational jihadist ah process
What do they mean by that? They wanted they explained that the US has
to be destroyed from within that they would infiltrate and destroy
the United States and crumble it from within Destroy what exactly the Constitution?
Destroy our freedoms destroy our way of life basically. And impose Sharia on the
United States? Well they didn’t say impose Sharia they talked about that this was a, you
know a, uh, kuffar or uh apostate system and that and they, the
ikhwan or the Muslim Brotherhood needed to
destroy this this regime this this this way of life
here now again they’re not very specific always in terms of their techniques but
they had the agenda and one of the ways they do it is by
infiltration infiltration into academia infiltration
into the media so that infiltration in Congress
infiltration into the Department of Justice so they have friends who do their
bidding I mean right now there was a case just a couple
months ago where a prosecutor in Oregon had to petition the Department of Justice to use the word jihad in an indictment of an Islamic terrorist. They
were not allowing him to use that word. That’s right. Why? Because. It’s their word it’s not our
word. Of course but we don’t allow this government this regime this
administration doesn’t allow the use of the term radical Islam I mean there’s a great scene in the film
of Eric Holder the attorney general when he’s quizzed by Lamar Smith head of the the House judiciary committee and Lamar
Smith asks him was radical Islam a factor in the last series of uh terrorist attacks and Eric Holder says uh what do you mean? And and he says well there are many different reasons and so Lamar Smith says but I am talking about radical Islam and Eric Holder says I don’t want to demean a religion and then Lamar Smith says I’m not talking about a religion I am talking about radical Islam I’m not talking about Islam the religion
There are a variety of reasons why people do these things. Some of them are
potentially religious. Okay, but all I’m asking is if you
think among those variety of reasons radical Islam might have been
one of the reasons uh, that the individuals took the steps that they did You see see radical Islam I mean I think those people who espouse a a version of Islam that is. Are you uncomfortable attributing any of their actions to radical
Islam Holder wouldn’t admit that radical
Islam was a factor It was one of the most incredibly
embarrassing factors, uh, (inaudible) episodes that I’ve ever seen in my
life of an attorney general. You also say that
there’s a language manipulations so they kind of
redefine certain phrases What does that mean well listen
terrorism is redefined jihad is redefined I mean they define jihad as you know they CARE the Council on
American-Islamic Relations which is a Hamas front as described by the FBI it was created by Hamas in the 1993 meeting Um they’ve established themselves as quote a civil rights group Deception here okay? They hide under the
civil rights mantle when in fact they have an ulterior agenda we know that we’ve taped them behind closed doors you can
see it in the film I mean that’s what the beauty of the film was I
didn’t want it to be polemical I didn’t want it to be rhetorical I wanted
the facts speak for themselves and the only way that could happen is if you got behind the scenes behind
closed doors and got them saying what they really meant and what they really said without knowing that they were being taped. Even the word
justice is redefined Right I mean they say well who’s gotta
There’s one man an interesting guy Abdur-Rahman Mohammed who who was a former Black Muslim militant who renounces his membership in in in the Muslim Brotherhood on camera for
the first time in the film and he openly states that that who could
have a problem with justice but justice he says can only come under the banner of Allah and until you have an Islamic state you cannot have justice that’s what he
says so that’s what they really mean by justice Who would ever have a problem with justice? Jihad is just to establish justice so when you hear the word justice you think fighting for someone’s rights
or um trying to make sure that no one is
mistreated or abused or whatever. That’s not how Muslim fundamentalist define justice okay? Justice can only come from Allah, from god we don’t we will never have justice until we have an Islamic state because whoever doesn’t rule by what Allah has revealed is an oppressor. The movie we’re
discussing is called Jihad in America The Grand Deception Steve Emerson is in the studio with me
he’s the executive director of the Investigative Project on Terrorism Steve are you in an echo chamber? I
mean sometimes I wonder if you’re only talking to people that agree
with you anyway. Sometimes I wonder about that myself look I’ve said to myself that the moment
I become irrelevant or the moment that that I have no impact
is the moment I leave although lately it’s because I get
300 emails a day and I work seventeen hours a day seven days a week but um I my bottom line is I need to
reach out to new audiences and I have to tell you when I go out and give speeches around the
country there’s a resonance and that people uh, uh unbelievable resonance because people
don’t know what’s happening because they don’t get the truth from government the
FBI is not a lie detector test they don’t
investigate lies or or radical Islamic statements unless there’s a criminal predicate and so who’s left to do that? It’s either the
fourth estate which is the media and they don’t do it the elite media look I can show you
emails, I can’t show it to you cuz I know the uh, it would uh, endanger my sources There are emails between CARE a Hamas front and reporters for the New
York Times and Detroit news and some other papers. Saying what? Well the reporters are saying how can we
help you and they take verbatim statements given to them by these radical Islamic
groups and they put ’em in the stories and we’re going to be coming out with a series of stories exposing that soon But saying what though I mean what do they want? Saying that CARE that that the muslims are under attack that there’s Islamophobia that that the there’s hate crimes galore which is simply not true that um that that um there there are no such, that all these Islam Islamic imams who come out with fatwahs against terrorism are sincere
like the New York Times has come out with two front page stories
in the last decade showing imams condemning terrorism saying that they’re
really sincere when we did an investigation of the imams who signed
the fatwa against terrorism we found that half of them were unindicted
co-conspirators in terrorism trials and the other half had called for terrorism
actually martyrdom or or suicide bombings so it was a total lie
but the but the Times reporter played right into
their hands again it may be guilt you know uh, collaboration
witting or unwitting but the end up result is deception and
the American public doesn’t get the truth So we’ve talked about like the Muslim
Brotherhood’s um media strategy language manipulation that kind of thing
but I wonder if you can point to one particular thing one particular policy that the United
States has had that has been changed as a result of their efforts Um I can tell you that um one uh policy has been that um they’ve stop prosecuting material
support for terrorism financiers Eric Holder the Attorney
General this is (inaudible) news because I haven’t come out with it yet publicly has quashed the indictment of of
several terrorist uh of prepared indictments by other US
attorneys that were submitted to main Justice of material support for
terrorism by Islamic terrorist financiers and they
quashed for political reasons um and um in addition to which various Islamic charities that were
known to be connected to terrorism had their non-profit status restored
to them under this administration because of pressure and three um the the FBI has cut back on the training of informants which is
the key to solving almost any terrorist attack okay um it’s not the meta data collection its
informants it’s human intelligence and they’ve cut back because of the
pressure by these Islamic groups who claim that the informants are are instigators are causing all
these problems when they’re not they’re basically just doing what happens in
the Mafia cases what happens in cartel cases They they find a conspiracy they put somebody inside they don’t egg them on but they
basically neutralize them and then they arrest them But how is a an organization like CARE
still around and still you know working and influential given I mean didn’t the FBI said say we’re not working with them anymore because we’re not sure about their links to Hamas Right in 2008 they sent a letter to
Congress saying we are no longer being involved with them because they have ties to
Hamas and yet in March of this year the CARE national
group met in Washington and they met with the 143 members of Congress
and law enforcement like Sheriff Lee Baca of Los Angeles
speaks before their conferences all the time Um you have Members of Congress who
honor them you have Dick Durbin who invites them to testify he’s a senator from Chicago. So you ask a great question. People don’t have don’t wanna read they don’t wanna
believe you know they don’t want they could look at our web site I mean today if you wanna find out what CARE is its
very easy to find out okay it’s not just us our website the
Investigative Project on Terrorism which is I have to say www investigative
project dot org but they’re so many other places that
that describe what CARE is and the local police are are are duped into
believing these people are peaceful and they this cognitive dissonance. So Steve there’s you know the argument goes like this:
that they want people to believe that there’s a war against Islam so we shouldn’t play into that strategy and we should do whatever we
can to prove that we’re not at war with them and that we shouldn’t use terms like
Islamic terrorism and so on Why shouldn’t use the word Islamic
terrorism I mean we use the word. Because then people will think that there’s a war against Islam. No but it’s Islamic terrorism we we do when we
use the term white racism do we think there’s a war against whites During the IRA uh Protestant uh you know war in Ireland routinely they referred to militant Protestants they referred to militant Protestants militant Christians, militant Catholics
Did we did anyone generalize that all Catholics were were terrorists that all Protestants no of course not and we’re not talking about all Muslims we’re talking about what informs their actions what informs
their actions is their belief in radical Islam and theology and so if we refuse to do that we’re playing
into their hands we take the onus and responsibility away from them to condemn radical Islam by removing from our vernacular that term in a sense we empower the radicals by removing that
term by not using the word jihad by not using the word radical Islam we
need to use those terms we need to put them on the defense so they will condemn it and not get away
with these word games which they twist everything around and
say that jihad means peace and love when it doesn’t What do you think the US government
needs to do differently Oh you don’t have time for that. Briefly. Well
briefly i I think one is look how did we defeat the Ku
Klux Klan? The Ku Klux Klan you know uh, years ago you know fifty years ago had tens of thousands of supporters and today it
has maybe just scores but it was defeated from being being de-
legitimized That’s what has to happen to these
groups they shouldn’t be invited to the White House we did an investigation right before the
election showing it that 400 members of the Muslim Brotherhood groups who had called for the destruction of the United States or Israel or the West some were unindicted
coconspirators had been invited to the White House over a four-year period they were
legitimized including Hamas including the front group
Hamas which the FBI won’t even deal with I mean FBI agents were following members
of of Hamas going into the White House they
had to stop. Of CARE you mean? Of CARE, right. Under investigation so so we need to de
legitimize them we need to put their and stop playing their games And stop playing into their games of
saying there’s no such thing as jihad there’s no such thing as violent war
there’s no such thing as as Islamic terrorism I mean were playing into, we’re empowering them we need to disempower them and we need to empower genuine moderates
like you Zuhdi Jasser or Qanta Ahmed or or uh others uh uh Asra Nomani uh They’re genuine but they don’t get the
the venue and the empowerment because there’s no money behind them and the Islamic groups vilify them. Steve
Emerson he’s executive director of the Investigative Project on Terrorism also executive producer of the
award-winning documentary film Jihad in America The Grand Deception.
Steve thank so much for being on the program you’re very welcome

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